StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

[rinku]

That is a pretty tall order for maybe 21 months on the market.

But putting unit numbers aside, the timing would be pretty similar to when GBA, DS, Switch got their first major Pokémon releases. Black 2 and White 2 arrived for DS well after 3DS's release, but even that was only 16 months (Japanese dates).

A rerun, but I think with proper scaling it'll usually be hard to tell the difference.

Good lord the Wii just flying off the chart in the second pic is hilarious.

 

[LinkURL]

From what I understand frame generation works far better when your framerate is already high to begin with (60fps+) and you want to pump it to the extremes (90fps+). Which would make sense since frame generation is essentially hallucinating images that never existed.

The Switch 2 isn't going to have the kind of performance to spare to get those high framerates in the first place, on top of the cost of rendering the fake frames, so yeah it always seemed to me that the performance hurdles would be the biggest reason not to expect frame generation on Switch 2.

Although this is true, I wouldn't completely rule out using it at lower framerates, what makes FG more difficult for OZ is that it still depends on the tensors cores to create these frames, and we know that perhaps OZ already has a difficulty with the default DLSS.

 

[Serif]

so you're saying there is hope for we the racoon tribe?

 

[oldpuck]

A rerun, but I think with proper scaling it'll usually be hard to tell the difference.

Do you have versions of this in motion?

I ask because my experience with FSR1 is it looks great in stills and falls completely apart in motion. The popping and fizzling of Tears of the Kingdom was certainly noticeable, and in Control on my SteamDeck it is so bad it made me motion sick.

But Deathloop was fine, and obviously that’s 800p not 1080p. So I assume it’s variable, but I don’t find the stills of FSR tell the whole story, but I don’t have a setup that could test it.

 

[mjayer]

I wouldn't expect Nintendo to stop publishing titles on Nintendo Switch until 2028 at the earliest.

IMO there's about a 0% chance of that. You might have a title or 2 released but not a lot and not consistent. You have to consider how much work goes into putting out a title, down porting won't be easy when the game is developed for much stronger hardware and utilizing features that aren't present in the older hardware, not to mention QA and testing that will have to be duplicated. Also, when has that ever been the case for Nintendo?

Also this is counter intuitive to building your new platform. You'd want to incentivize consumers to upgrade to the new generation, not stay where they are.

 

[Steve]

IMO there's about a 0% chance of that. You might have a title or 2 released but not a lot and not consistent. You have to consider how much work goes into putting out a title, down porting won't be easy when the game is developed for much stronger hardware and utilizing features that aren't present in the older hardware, not to mention QA and testing that will have to be duplicated. Also, when has that ever been the case for Nintendo?

it could work for ports and remasters of older games, like Mario Galaxy 2 and some gamecube games, meanwhile the Switch will be supported by Indies and smaller scoped games, like box girl and box boy.

I think the best way of satisfying Switch owners, when the Switch 2 releases is just by, releasing NSO games and ports of old games.

Like i fully expect all of Nintendo larger team are currently making Switch 2 games, meanwhile the smaller ones are making cross gen titles.

 

[Concernt]

IMO there's about a 0% chance of that. You might have a title or 2 released but not a lot and not consistent. You have to consider how much work goes into putting out a title, down porting won't be easy when the game is developed for much stronger hardware and utilizing features that aren't present in the older hardware, not to mention QA and testing that will have to be duplicated. Also, when has that ever been the case for Nintendo?

Also this is counter intuitive to building your new platform. You'd want to incentivize consumers to upgrade to the new generation, not stay where they are.

When has that been the case for Nintendo? Only since forever. Wario's Woods was a 1995 NES game.

Nintendo 3DS got two years post launch with no compatibility to rely on with the new console and a much smaller userbase.

I don't think you quite picked up on what I was saying. I said publishing titles. Not packaged software. Not major titles. Just titles. Nintendo publishes Mario's Picross Deluxe in 2028? That counts. I'm specifically NOT stating that they would put effort into "downporting" or doubling up on their efforts. If a game can function on Switch, AS IS, no reason not to put it there. I mean things like Snipperclips 2, not... Kirby's Forgotten Universe.

Nintendo Switch has a large, engaged userbase. Three years of Nintendo providing smaller titles to that audience is anything but some foreign, far off idea, it's the modern day norm and once Nintendo's MO. Do we forget so quickly how late some GBA games came out. Again, I refer to my message - compatibility changes the game considerably. These would be releases for BOTH consoles, and I don't think Nintendo sees genuine hardware pushing power in... Pushmo Collection HD.

To repeat myself once more; cross gen titles are not a doubling up of efforts, especially not when you're the platform holder and the two systems share a compatibility profile. They are getting more audience for the same, or a negligible amount more, effort. Nobody expects Nintendo to downport The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Pie Factory. But a quiet re-release of say, Super Mario Galaxy for Nintendo Switch, that doesn't take moving the earth and sky.

 

[oldpuck]

IMO there's about a 0% chance of that. You might have a title or 2 released but not a lot and not consistent. You have to consider how much work goes into putting out a title, down porting won't be easy when the game is developed for much stronger hardware and utilizing features that aren't present in the older hardware, not to mention QA and testing that will have to be duplicated. Also, when has that ever been the case for Nintendo?

I mean, Nintendo spent a lot of money downporting WiiU titles to 3DS, and those were totally unrelated technology stacks.

I’m with you that it’s a huge power gap to deal with, and I am dubious about extended cross-gen. But they don’t need to downscale, they can go the opposite direction. Pokémon, Fire Emblem, Kirby, and even 2D Metroid are all franchises that lived primarily on handheld, which don’t traditionally have super long tails.

They could continue as 30fps Switch games for years, and just run upscaled 60fps on NG, and would probably sell more than moving exclusive, without harming NG sales.

In the past I argued that Switch support could reasonably continue until the equivalent of the NG Lite comes out. You can treat the Switch as “the handheld” for a few years until you have the version that specifically targets the same demographic as Pokémon. I don’t know if they will, but the certainly could.

 

[MetalLord]

Isnt weird that theres no mass hirings going on ? things are too quiet nowadays,it dont even feel like most teams are right now developing for a system 10x more powerfull, most nintendo affiliate studios have less open positions than usual, next level games is not even hiring anyone, nintendo for the first time since 2017 have 0 contracts open,wonder if there will be more cross gen titles than people expect

プロジェクト採用：募集要項｜採用情報｜任天堂

任天堂株式会社のプロジェクト採用情報のページです。

www.nintendo.co.jp

 

[Shareholder Chad]

I have it on good authority that internally at Nintendo (Edit: At least some years ago), the 3DS was more regarded as a gut punch than the Wii-U. The words I received from a Nintendo employee during one of my trips years ago was basically the general feeling was that it had "dishonored" their company and was a complete shock. The Wii-U however had the feeling of a "swing and a miss" rather than a complete failure. Even their stock price went into its dark ages after the 3DS, Not after the Wii-U.

It was always interesting me how they spoke of the 3DS. It was like the worst thing they ever did despite the virtual boy and Wii-U existing and arguably worse commercial failures.

 

[TamazonX]

More or less my train of thought as well. If they don't want to name it a boring "2" then they could name it super, electric boogaloo or whatever and let the marketing, image, presentation, OS, hardware appearance, etc. do the rest of the work to differentiate it.

Love your signature btw. SFC color layout is already a given in my headcanon.



I agree but I also think that if they managed to communicate that properly in a pre-internet era, it's not impossible today. Not saying IT WILL BE called the Super Switch, just saying it's not a impossibility.
The casual market may be able to remember the SNES and buy it for their kids, in which case the casual market would be somewhat successfully captured.
Again, I'm no expert, I'm basically just imagining a best case scenario.

Imagine 2 colorways on launch. One with the NA SNES purple, one with the JPN SFC multiple colors

 

[CalmMind]

* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *

If those leaked dimensions are correct, it won't matter because the next Switch won't fit them.

 

[Truno]

Snip

 

[chocolate_supra]

 

[OctoSplattack]

I believe Mochizuki's previous report was, "March at the earliest"

That's the same article from February. The line "Nintendo has told some publishing executives not to expect the console until March 2025 at the earliest" is two paragraphs later.

 

[darthdiablo]

I believe Mochizuki's previous report was, "March at the earliest"

No real changes right? Just Bloomberg rehashing old news?

 

[Dekuman]

and on that note, I'm out

have fun out there gamers

oh, didn't see this. well , hope to see you back soon.

 

[Kise Ryota]

The GameCube was in my opinion the most impressive console of its time

I still play Star Wars Rogue Squadron 2+3 on mine. It's so beautiful, specially if you have an HDMI mod. For me, the most impressive game there.

But I still remember when I tried the original Xbox. That thing was a beast. For sure the most impressive console from that generation, IMO.

 

[Truno]

That's the same article from February. The line "Nintendo has told some publishing executives not to expect the console until March 2025 at the earliest" is two paragraphs later.

Correct, edited post

 

[Serif]

I believe Mochizuki's previous report was, "March at the earliest"

This Tweet links to his report from February 16.

Edit: Ninja'd.

 

[Concernt]

If those leaked dimensions are correct, it won't matter because the next Switch won't fit them.

 

[ILikeFeet]

Isnt weird that theres no mass hirings going on ? things are too quiet nowadays,it dont even feel like most teams are right now developing for a system 10x more powerfull, most nintendo affiliate studios have less open positions than usual, next level games is not even hiring anyone, nintendo for the first time since 2017 have 0 contracts open,wonder if there will be more cross gen titles than people expect

プロジェクト採用：募集要項｜採用情報｜任天堂

任天堂株式会社のプロジェクト採用情報のページです。

www.nintendo.co.jp

I think at this point Nintendo is working to lock-in games for the first year, so taking time to on-board new people will have to wait until the first wave is over

 

[eye0h]

It's so late for me I almost started fucking tweaking ngl

 

[Dekuman]

* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *

 

[Serif]

* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *

 

[Concernt]

* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *

 

[Concernt]

* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *

 

[redmutineer75]

I have it on good authority that internally at Nintendo (Edit: At least some years ago), the 3DS was more regarded as a gut punch than the Wii-U. The words I received from a Nintendo employee during one of my trips years ago was basically the general feeling was that it had "dishonored" their company and was a complete shock. The Wii-U however had the feeling of a "swing and a miss" rather than a complete failure. Even their stock price went into its dark ages after the 3DS, Not after the Wii-U.

It was always interesting me how they spoke of the 3DS. It was like the worst thing they ever did despite the virtual boy and Wii-U existing and arguably worse commercial failures.

I think it’s because by that point, they expected that not every home console would be a hit (N64, GameCube), but they never had a handheld that struggled. Their worst-selling handheld by that point was the GBA, and that was because it only had 3 years in the spotlight. That the 3DS so dramatically fumbled out the gate to the point that they had to slash the price by $80 just 5 months after release was an incredible disappointment.

 

[Famicrono]

I have it on good authority that internally at Nintendo (Edit: At least some years ago), the 3DS was more regarded as a gut punch than the Wii-U. The words I received from a Nintendo employee during one of my trips years ago was basically the general feeling was that it had "dishonored" their company and was a complete shock. The Wii-U however had the feeling of a "swing and a miss" rather than a complete failure. Even their stock price went into its dark ages after the 3DS, Not after the Wii-U.

It was always interesting me how they spoke of the 3DS. It was like the worst thing they ever did despite the virtual boy and Wii-U existing and arguably worse commercial failures.

I remember a comment about Iwata being on “ejection seat” (?) (Edit: Here ) after the 3DS weak launch, the salary cut and the kinda desperate price cut. Must have been something that really caught them by surprise.

I feel that they really got arrogant with the massive success of DS/Wii and good reception of the 3DS at E3 2010 was a main factor for them to put that $249 price tag.

 

[SimplyCinnamon]

I have it on good authority that internally at Nintendo (Edit: At least some years ago), the 3DS was more regarded as a gut punch than the Wii-U. The words I received from a Nintendo employee during one of my trips years ago was basically the general feeling was that it had "dishonored" their company and was a complete shock. The Wii-U however had the feeling of a "swing and a miss" rather than a complete failure. Even their stock price went into its dark ages after the 3DS, Not after the Wii-U.

It was always interesting me how they spoke of the 3DS. It was like the worst thing they ever did despite the virtual boy and Wii-U existing and arguably worse commercial failures.

Why would they feel that way about the 3DS? It sold a very respectable number of units and wasn’t it profitable for them?

 

[Giancarlo]

Isnt weird that theres no mass hirings going on ? things are too quiet nowadays,it dont even feel like most teams are right now developing for a system 10x more powerfull, most nintendo affiliate studios have less open positions than usual, next level games is not even hiring anyone, nintendo for the first time since 2017 have 0 contracts open,wonder if there will be more cross gen titles than people expect

プロジェクト採用：募集要項｜採用情報｜任天堂

任天堂株式会社のプロジェクト採用情報のページです。

www.nintendo.co.jp

didnt Nintendo hired 400 people for march of last year to march this year? or i misundertand something?

 

[Kevin]

* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *

 

[Concernt]

Wait who puts a hyphen in the word Wii U.

 

[oldpuck]

Isnt weird that theres no mass hirings going on ?

No? Why would we expect mass hirings? Nintendo has been growing for a while, and it’s awfully late to be hiring up. If you were hiring up for the launch, you’d start three years ago.

 

[Lugia667]

didnt Nintendo hired 400 people for march of last year to march this year? or i misundertand something?

yeah they did

 

[lexony]

Personally I‘d also love to have a Nintendo handheld with a smaller screen again. I expect that there could be a Lite Version a few years later, given that Switch Lite sold 20 million I think it‘s not that unlikely.

Make it foldable and about the size of the 3DS XL and I am fully onboard.

 

[MetalLord]

didnt Nintendo hired 400 people for march of last year to march this year? or i misundertand something?

nintendo itself grew only by 35 (they transfered some staff to nintendo systems so we cant know the real number) nintendo as a whole counting all first party studios and branches worldwide hired 400

会社情報：会社概要

任天堂株式会社の会社概要のページです。

www.nintendo.co.jp

会社情報：会社概要

任天堂株式会社の会社概要のページです。

web.archive.org

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

Do you have versions of this in motion?

I ask because my experience with FSR1 is it looks great in stills and falls completely apart in motion. The popping and fizzling of Tears of the Kingdom was certainly noticeable, and in Control on my SteamDeck it is so bad it made me motion sick.

Fair point, and I do not.

IMO there's about a 0% chance of that. You might have a title or 2 released but not a lot and not consistent. You have to consider how much work goes into putting out a title, down porting won't be easy when the game is developed for much stronger hardware and utilizing features that aren't present in the older hardware, not to mention QA and testing that will have to be duplicated. Also, when has that ever been the case for Nintendo?

Also this is counter intuitive to building your new platform. You'd want to incentivize consumers to upgrade to the new generation, not stay where they are.

Depends on the game. Like, if we lived in a world where Switch 2 was already out and with a userbase of say 15 million, how much would it have served a game like Mario vs Donkey Kong remake to ditch the entire Switch 1 userbase for some more graphical effects?

You want to incentivize consumers to upgrade, sure, but the fruit of that effort is to be able to sell to the large userbase you've created. So pretty wasteful to abandon it while consumers are still actively buying and most of them cannot possibly have upgraded yet.

 

[Sin & Punishment]

I have it on good authority that internally at Nintendo (Edit: At least some years ago), the 3DS was more regarded as a gut punch than the Wii-U. The words I received from a Nintendo employee during one of my trips years ago was basically the general feeling was that it had "dishonored" their company and was a complete shock. The Wii-U however had the feeling of a "swing and a miss" rather than a complete failure. Even their stock price went into its dark ages after the 3DS, Not after the Wii-U.

It was always interesting me how they spoke of the 3DS. It was like the worst thing they ever did despite the virtual boy and Wii-U existing and arguably worse commercial failures.

I wonder why that is.

Is it because they view their handhelds as their bread and butter?

 

[Steve]

I wonder why that is.

Is it because they view their handhelds as their bread and butter?

I think that’s the likeliest answer.

Like Nintendo historically never struggled with their handheld, that was until the 3DS came around and was a failure at launch for multiple reasons, like, lacklustre exclusives, mobile gaming being in its peak interest, the awful price point and also the bleh marketing.

It’s actually extremely impressive how the 3DS wasn’t a larger failure, somehow the revisions, price cut and 3D Land saved the 3DS.

 

[omniryu]

the source is Khu, who has lost pretty much all their credibility. besides, they're just saying obvious shit

It makes me wonder, can fame cause an addiction?

 

[Concernt]

Personally I‘d also love to have a Nintendo handheld with a smaller screen again. I expect that there could be a Lite Version a few years later, given that Switch Lite sold 20 million I think it‘s not that unlikely.

Make it foldable and about the size of the 3DS XL and I am fully onboard.

I think a clamshell would be a good direction to head with it. Consider a Lite if you sliced the controllers off, and that's your "folded" size, maybe a bit thicker. Just small enough to be pocketable. T239 on 4N would be small enough for that, but the battery would be a question to be answered.

 

[MetalLord]

eighting made a unreal 5 tech demo

https://www.8ing.co.jp/_cms/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Octo-PV2.mp4

pikmin 5 gonna look amazing lol

 

[OctoSplattack]

I wonder why that is.

Is it because they view their handhelds as their bread and butter?

I'd imagine so. While their home consoles had seen noticeable declines in sales each generation, their handhelds have always done pretty well out of the gate until the 3DS (what the heck is a Virtual Boy? are you speaking in tongues?). So having a handheld with a terrible launch would probably hurt more than the Wii U, as they were begrudgingly already used to their home offerings underperforming half the time.

 

[Instro]

Isnt weird that theres no mass hirings going on ? things are too quiet nowadays,it dont even feel like most teams are right now developing for a system 10x more powerfull, most nintendo affiliate studios have less open positions than usual, next level games is not even hiring anyone, nintendo for the first time since 2017 have 0 contracts open,wonder if there will be more cross gen titles than people expect

プロジェクト採用：募集要項｜採用情報｜任天堂

任天堂株式会社のプロジェクト採用情報のページです。

www.nintendo.co.jp

They might be in a lull, depending on when their budgetary processes take place for annual increases, promotions, and recruiting approvals. I usually don't follow their postings closely enough to know what is normal at different times of the year though. I'd probably defer to you lol.

They've certainly been growing at a much more rapid pace in recent years than in generations past, and the comments from Furukawa would indicate that it will continue. Based on the special spending previously outlined for recruitment, and the new building, it seems unlikely they have any intention of stopping.

 

[ILikeFeet]

It makes me wonder, can fame cause an addiction?

yea it can. attention and affection can drive people to bad places

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Isnt weird that theres no mass hirings going on ? things are too quiet nowadays,it dont even feel like most teams are right now developing for a system 10x more powerfull, most nintendo affiliate studios have less open positions than usual, next level games is not even hiring anyone, nintendo for the first time since 2017 have 0 contracts open,wonder if there will be more cross gen titles than people expect

プロジェクト採用：募集要項｜採用情報｜任天堂

任天堂株式会社のプロジェクト採用情報のページです。

www.nintendo.co.jp

It's probably just that they aren't hiring much because of the downturn in the gaming industry as a whole.

 

[gonanzir]

Nintendo even has a history of releasing games on older consoles up to four years after launching new ones, but they stopped this practice starting with the N64.

 

[Shareholder Chad]

Why would they feel that way about the 3DS? It sold a very respectable number of units and wasn’t it profitable for them?

I wonder why that is.

Is it because they view their handhelds as their bread and butter?

As @Famicrono and @redmutineer75 said, The way everything went down at launch and the fact that they were extremely successful previously in the handheld market.

I also believe the fact that Nintendo was forced to lower the price point soon after launch caused big issues for their investors. Like the banks for instance, Not the individual investors like I was. It "felt" like the worst launch in Nintendo's history regardless of where the numbers fell. First party support was questionable, 3rd party support lacked quality, and all Nintendo did to appease early adopters was give 10 or so free roms lol.

Just some of the stories I've heard over the years from the 3DS era was kind of chilling.

Tinfoil hat: I do believe the 3DS is partly responsible for the conservative route Nintendo is taking with the Switch 2.

 

[RedBees]

I have it on good authority that internally at Nintendo (Edit: At least some years ago), the 3DS was more regarded as a gut punch than the Wii-U. The words I received from a Nintendo employee during one of my trips years ago was basically the general feeling was that it had "dishonored" their company and was a complete shock. The Wii-U however had the feeling of a "swing and a miss" rather than a complete failure. Even their stock price went into its dark ages after the 3DS, Not after the Wii-U.

It was always interesting me how they spoke of the 3DS. It was like the worst thing they ever did despite the virtual boy and Wii-U existing and arguably worse commercial failures.

I think it's rather forgotten nowadays that the real "Nintendoomed" era wasn't the 2014/2015 Wii U days, it was the early 2010s. The DS was fading, the Wii had harshly fallen off in popularity (its sales trajectory was really more that of a fad than a sustainable console like the FC/SFC or Switch), and the 3DS' first year was incredibly weak with popular perception being that mobile was killing handheld game consoles and the 3DS could never recover. Things improved around 2013 as the 3DS library filled out, and by the time the Wii U was abandoned internally for the Switch, their prospects were actually looking a lot better.